Back in 2008, a customer purchased a laptop from Sony, but refused to accept its end-user license agreement due to its pre-installed software. The customer contacted Sony, demanding to be reimbursed for the junkware. Sony, instead, offered a refund for the PC. The customer, instead of taking the refund, sued Sony for about 3000 Euros.
According to The Register, the EU's highest court has just ruled against the customer.
Honestly, this makes sense. The software was around when they purchased the computer, and Sony offered a refund. Yes, companies should offer crapware-free versions of their laptops, even for a slight fee. If adware-free version existed at all, then there might be an issue, but that would belong with Microsoft (or whoever owns the actual platform). It shouldn't be a burden for the individual system builders, unless collusion was involved.
It's also funny to think that, since the laptop was purchased in 2008, we are probably talking about a Vista-era device. Interesting to think about the difference in speed between the legal system and the tech industry.
What happened here is the
What happened here is the customer wanted a laptop free of Sony’s pre-installed image OS and keep the hardware and install it’s own OS and such.
Sony refused to reimburse their undisclosed cost of the pre-installed image. So the customer sued Sony like a group once did with M$ and the Open community who did not agree to the EULA.
Sony offered to reimburse the cost of the whole laptop if it was returned.
I understand that the customer wanted to make Sony change their business practices and offer more customisable options, but they won’t. Even them sharing the cost of that image won’t happen. That’s probably to hide the high profit gains.
Hence why I pick PC builders that has those options. And usually their pre-installed image doesn’t have much or any crapware. But you also pay more for that option or it cost the same if you would install it yourself.
When you have the time, it doesn’t hurt to try — most of the time —
The difference is the
The difference is the previous lawsuit was to refund the cost of the Windows license (because the customer wanted to install another OS, and thus NOT use the Windows license). In this lawsuit the customer wanted to KEEP the Windows license, but be refunded the ‘cost’ of other applications pre-installed on the machine. i.e. they wanted to have their cake and eat it too.
If the suit was to provide a device free of the bundled Windows license entirely (and the customer provide their own license and install) it would likely have met with a better chance of success.
Thanks for the added info.
Thanks for the added info. Didn’t notice it was for the pre-installed software and not the OS entirely.
Often, these pre-install software help pay for the OS License. The same you see when installing Java or Flash where it has the option to install other software — sadly checked by default –. As you said, might have been best for the customer to fight to be refunded for the complete Image and OS License.
Then on their own, the customer could have used the funds to buy their own OS License and find the required Drivers for it.
Thing is, with way laptop’s
Thing is, with way laptop’s are made. All they had to do was download a legit legal windows iso and install windows fresh and clean. I did that with my dell laptop i bought about 2-3 months back. Did complete fresh clean install of windows 10 on it. License is with the laptop is detected and activated with 0 input. As said this seemed more like someone wanted a free laptop and used bloat ware as an excuse to get $, reality is yes without that software the laptop costs more.
^this right here.
^this right here.
I’ll take money off the cost of the device if getting it the way I want is as simple as installing an OS. An OS that Microsoft often makes easy to download on their own website.
No the user did not want to
No the user did not want to pay the M$ windows Tax, but M$ made with the dosh and the EU court fell in line! He should heve went with maybe a system 76/other linux laptop OEM’s laptop products but even there the NvTel folks have AMD locked out of the action. I’m waiting for one of the Linux based laptop OEM’s to start using some Zen/Polaris APU’s before 2020 so I can make the switch from windows 7 to Linux on my new laptop Kit! Because I want a Monopoly free laptop without M$, Intel, or Nvidia’s pricy kit inside!
Sony sold its Viao operation, so Sony is out of the loop in the laptop market! But the OEM PC/laptop market will continue to get smaller and users are better off avoiding that market and going with a mini/micro form factor build and their hardware/OS of choice sans the nasty OEM bloatware!
If you don’t accept the EULA,
If you don’t accept the EULA, then you can’t use the application, I assume, so no cake for you. Unless you lie and use it anyway, but the user probably had strong disagreement with what was in the EULA, or just had no use for the application. Expecting a refund for a bundled application that you don’t want to use is a bit bogus though. You kind of accepted that those applications were included when you bought it, even if you have no intention of using them. There are many products that might have features that you would never use, but you generally do not expect a refund.
Hmmm this happened back in
Hmmm this happened back in 2008. Sony is still around? Do they even make laptops anymore? Their laptops were always some of the most overpriced shit so youd hope it was bloatware free.
About 2-3 years ago, VAIO was
About 2-3 years ago, VAIO was spun out of Sony VAIO into its own company.
“In the Windows 10 era, as
“In the Windows 10 era, as Microsoft’s licensing revenue drops, the company’s finding creative ways to squeeze extra money out of customers, especially businesses.”(1)
If you wnat to turn M$’s Consumer Experience you will have to pay $7 monthly for the Enterprise edition.
“One gotcha with Windows 10 Pro that will be particularly disappointing to consultants managing small businesses is the inability to turn off the Consumer Experience. That means after each feature update you’ll need to manually remove those suggested apps. And that’s just one of several Group Policy options that require Enterprise edition.”(1)
“Windows Enterprise is the most misunderstood of all editions. It’s available as an upgrade only, and for businesses, it requires an underlying Pro license. Enterprise edition includes additional licensing rights, such as the ability to run Windows in up to four virtual machines and to deploy Windows via imaging rights.
Traditionally, Enterprise has been sold through Volume Licensing agreements, which aren’t available for small businesses. That’s changing as of this month, with the option for small businesses and individuals to purchase Windows 10 Enterprise as a subscription option (Windows 10 E3) for $7 a month.
Enterprise edition has the most management options, including Windows Update for Business and the ability to suppress the annoying Consumer Experience with Group Policy.
The upshot of all these changes is to push and prod people who might previously have been happy with Home edition to move up to Pro, and to encourage a similar upgrade option for Pro users to move to Enterprise.
Just be prepared to pay.”(1)
“Microsoft’s new business model for Windows 10: Pay to play”
edit: If you wnat to turn
edit: If you wnat to turn
to” If you want to turn off
Often when I buy a new
Often when I buy a new (windows) PC or (android) Phone, I ask myself who was the customer? Was I the customer? Or was it the company selling the crapware and have I reduced myself to something more closely related to livestock.
Welcome to the future. You
Welcome to the future. You are the product. You have been since your first Hotmail account.
Hate to sound like a reddit
Hate to sound like a reddit drone, but this ^^.
Ownership of something is becoming more rare these days. I blame big business, stockholders, and the ever expanding willful ignorance of people.
Corrections, you should blame
Corrections, you should blame the people who mindlessly obey anything those corporations say. and peoples stupidity let to this.
Ok, to be fair, people who
Ok, to be fair, people who want a bare bones laptop are PRETTY rare, specialy with the nightmare of drivers needed to get full funtionaily outa one of those fuckers. It seems fair that dude wanted re-embersment for the cost of OS, but SERIOUSLY, what does sony even pay for O.E.M. licences at the number they buy them, couple of bucks probably
Its even harder now that the
Its even harder now that the worst spyware of all comes preinstalled: windows 10.
I cant believe im saying this but i LOVE windows 8 by comparison, and the whole metro bullshit is infuriating, yet its still 10x better than 10.
I like 10, there is a program
I like 10, there is a program from makers of spybot called anti-beacon that turns off most of the stuff you hate.
Doesnt change the fact that
Doesnt change the fact that microsoft hard coded the spyware in and can obliterate the spybot thing any time they want.
Well according to Ed (For M$)
Well according to Ed (For M$) Bott small buiness users and individuals can pay $7 per month and get the enterprise edition of windows 10. One wonders if that was M$ plan all along! But PCPer needs to look into this, and find out just how much extra over the $7 it will cost for an individual to get complete control over the OS and their PC/Laptop hardware under this $7 plan form M$.
“Traditionally, Enterprise has been sold through Volume Licensing agreements, which aren’t available for small businesses. That’s changing as of this month, with the option for small businesses and individuals to purchase Windows 10 Enterprise as a subscription option (Windows 10 E3) for $7 a month.”
“Microsoft’s new business model for Windows 10: Pay to play”
Getting More Linux OS based
Getting More Linux OS based laptop OEM’s like system76/others to start offering AMD APU options should be on AMD’s priority list! So there can be more OEM support for laptops that come with and support Linux based OSs. There are not enough Linux OEM laptop choices out there yet for non Intel/Nvidia laptops from the OEMs that offer laptops that come a Linux OS factory installed.
In the EU I thought there where more Linux laptop options than in the US, where monopolies control things! But OEMs should be required to at least offer some Linux OS options for users that want a different OS, even if that means the laptop costs a little more.
AMD has to carefully choose
AMD has to carefully choose how it spends money, and supporting the Linux desktop is arguably not a good investment.
It’s chicken-and-egg with Linux. Not enough users so it’s hard to justify investing into the ecosystem. But won’t get more users until it gets better…
Vulkan will have more devices
Vulkan will have more devices than windows 10 ever could hope for as Vulkan will be used for all of the mobile market devices that utilize the Linux kernel. Also AMD will be getting back into the server/HPC market and that market uses Linux also much more than windows! If Intel/Nvidia can justify developing for Linux then so can AMD, and AMD is already committing more for Linux development, as well as Blender 3d, and other Open Source development. AMD needs the laptop market more for sales of its APUs, as the PC market is shrinking ever year. So AMD needs to get its Zen/Polaris APU SKUs in some of the Linux Laptop OEM’s product offerings so users can get their Linux OS based OEM laptop without any of Intel’s/Nvidia’s/M$ products used to make the Laptop!
The entire Linux Kernel OS based market does just fine without M$, Nvidia, and Intel inside, so there needs to be some Linux Laptop options that are all AMD/Linux/Vulkan inside for some more affordable Linux OS based OEM laptop options!
STEP#1 – notice
STEP#1 – notice crapware
STEP#2 – start making a coffee
STEP#3 – remove the crapware
STEP#4 – drink your still hot coffee
All PC manufacturers are sh!t
All PC manufacturers are sh!t sellers since they actually don’t provide any user support for all the crapwares they preinstalled.
OEM licenses of Windows are pretty lucrative for Microsoft without user support (only for complete licenses) if not Windows update because that’s the deal the Redmond company made with manufacturers for selling in mass their Windows tax on each machine.
I won’t be surprised if Microsoft wouldn’t sell complete licenses in the future to make more money…
Still, I won’t be surprised if customers wouldn’t buy new computers with a lot of unsupported crapwares.
This could be a good opportunity for Apple to sell a MacOS tax since I don’t expect Apple to provide a better user support for non Apple hardware.